Who R U Really?

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Some things have to be believed to be seen. ~ Ralph Hodgson, on ESP

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[Daniel]

Of Course. This is the first question always asked on our journey, our quest. It may also be the last.

Here's another look at some of the possible answers:

You are what others think of you
You are who you think you are
You are how others treat you
You are how you treat yourself
You are you appearance and how others react to that
You are your appearance and how you react to that
You are how much money you make and how others react to that
You are how much money you make and how you react to that
You are what you do for a living and how others react to that
You are what you do for a living and how you react to that
You are your education and the contents of your mind and the level of intelligence you express at and the level of your creativity.
You are your education and the contents of your mind and the level of intelligence you express at and the level of your creativity and how others react to that.
You are your weight
You are your weight and how others react to that.
You are your race
You are your race and how others react to that
You are your sex
You are your sex and how others react to that
You are your sexual desire
You are how others react to your sexual desire.
You are your desire
You are how others react to your desire.
You are your nationality
You are your nationality and how others react to that
You are where you live
You are where you live and how others react to that
You are what you say
You are what you say and how others react to that
You are your language
you are how others react to your language.
You are your posts
You are your posts and how others react to that

I guess I could go on and on and on. And the correct answer is that you are none of these. But its exactly all of these that 99% of us are totally lost in. So, are we really lost? Ah, the Integral answer. Transcend and include. And yet, there is a huge fight and struggle as to what each of us is to INCLUDE along with our groundless being. And so here we go...lost again. Or is it part of the discovery?

Dan

[jimtzu]

And so here we go...lost again. Or is it part of the discovery?

Rhetorical questions??....  or is that one? ..... 

i think you find yourself every time that you realize that you're lost. in that moment of lost-ness you are aware of where you really are and in the next moment you realize you couldn't be anywhere else, so how can you be lost. feeling found or lost are just illusions, as much as feeling seperate from anything.  since everything is interconnected how could you not be where you're supposed to be, awakening to the fact the your quest has turned into a journey, allowing you to take the next step, not in doubt, but with eyes wide open in wonderment....

[Daniel]

Thanks Jimtzu. The question came to mind while meditating. I saw my limitations, how I hung my hat on so many things and this being one root of illusion, delusion and unhappiness. Also a sense of frustration on how almost impossible it is to break free of it. It fixates on Wilbers emphasis of identity being a fundamental line of development. Who sets the priorities for identity? Your employer? You? Your Spouse? Your Parents? Your friends? Who CONTROLS WHO you are? YOU? Or, THEM?

What you say is true...but upon what foundation of what identity? Who or what is controlling that and how consciously or unconsciously? Truth based on illusion? Illusion based on truth?

Dan

[jimtzu]

hey Daniel, it's easy to get caught up in linear thinking, maps and theories will do that to you.  WHO is under that hat that you hang on so many things, you are all of them and yet none of them at the same time.  we all get confused because we're looking at things sequentially (can't see the forest?) jumping from one facet of our lives to the next, thinking one is seperate from the other. it can make one feel schizofrentic till one steps back and see all the parts make up the (w)hole-on and yet even that doesn't cover it all.  in space-time it's what you identify WITH at that particular moment/place.  it's been expressed better over the years,  the koan "what is your original face" comes to mind.... but WHO'S mind? 

[Daniel]

Here's an ILP that emphasises the "original face".

The headless way


http://www.headless.org/


Douglas Harding

[marshall]

I was watching V For Vandetta again the other day and was impressed as V explained to Evie that the face behind the mask was no more him than the muscles and bones in his body were. Also on that day I viewed the Brian Swimme videocasts (which I thought were fairly lame) in which he stressed that nature created eyes 40-60 separate times throughout history.

What does that have to do with this thread? Well,.....it seems to me that the more traditional method for "realization" is a path of negation and can be seen in practices like the onion game, which seems to be the BBG's favorite method (you are not this (body), you are not that (mind)).

What is so nice about the koan given here by Jim is that it lets one draw one's own conclusions. Me, I'll just try to spoil the delight of the discovery. I believe the the greater reality is that we are both immanent (billion year old carbon) and transcendent (nonphysical "spirit"). The Relative and the Absolute have been weaving together in the play of Creation from the unidentifiable beginning. When we look at the Gross, we might see that Thou Art That. Same with the subtle - we all stand on the shoulders of giants. The Causal level is where we are none.

TWO TRUTHS in perfect harmony